| 7/25/2008 1:38:20 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | |  jmk83 Florissant, MO age: 25
| People look at bio fuels as if they are some new thing that was created as an alternative to oil being ever so high. But in actuality george washington carver created the first one out of soy, as did he make a soy-based form of lightweight yet strong plastic. He and Henry Ford got to gether shortly after the modern assembly line was created when the model-t's were rolling off the line, and created a car that ran off soy based bio fuel and its body and interior was made intirely of the soy-based plastic, and other soy-derived materials.
So if we had this technology way back when then why did it not take off then? The government thought it would be better and cheaper to use oil based petro. Even though soy-based bio fuel could be grown all over america and give the farmers a healthy paycheck. While some of the oil used in america was and still is drilled here, 90 percent comes from over seas where the oil companies can pay small countries with no economy less money per week than they would end up paying per inch of soy to farmers.
This whole time the back bone of american life(the farmer) could have been living well and sending kids to college instead of being broke and getting paid not to farm food, since it too can be grown, picked, and shipped cheaper than they could do.
So what ended up happening was farmers lost their land because they couldnt afford to pay on their loans anymore, and now those farms are subburbs. So my point is why did we go with oil when the american public could have greatly prospered and been independent of forign influence? Was the american peoples best interest at hand there, or was big business taking advantage?
Dont get me wrong i dont want anytype of grain or food based bio deisel. I would much rather see swithgrass used since it has a higher output of energy vs. energy needed to make it ratio. Not to mention it wont jack the prices of food way up. Another interesting fact is like hay you can get two crops a season out of it. And the stuff grows like weeds in almost any climate.
So i leave to you to discuss with me whether or not the decision had the american people or big business at mind.
| | 7/25/2008 1:59:41 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | | jrbogie Red Bluff, CA age: 59
| why? simple ecconomics. like these easy ones.
| | 7/25/2008 2:00:54 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | |  jmk83 Florissant, MO age: 25
| why? simple ecconomics. like these easy ones. 
Please explain what you mean.
| | 7/25/2008 2:12:18 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | | jrbogie Red Bluff, CA age: 59
| you don't like that corporations are as powerful as they are but in reality they are what made this country great. the corporate heads at the time you speak of found oil to be the most profitable for of fuel. it was being drilled long before the automobile for the kerosene used in lighting and heating. gasoline was actually an unwanted byproduct of refining. it was a simple reach to profit from this byproduct with the invention of the eternal compustion engine.
people often ask how we ended up with vhs instead of betamax, the two rival video technologies early on. the answer is simple. that is what the market chose. the markets rule whether you approve or not. always have. always will. when a gallon of gas sells for 12 bucks a gallon it will be economically feasable for someone to capitalize on profits from alternative fuels. not until. off to bed.
| | 7/25/2008 2:17:40 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | |  jmk83 Florissant, MO age: 25
| you don't like that corporations are as powerful as they are but in reality they are what made this country great. the corporate heads at the time you speak of found oil to be the most profitable for of fuel. it was being drilled long before the automobile for the kerosene used in lighting and heating. gasoline was actually an unwanted byproduct of refining. it was a simple reach to profit from this byproduct with the invention of the eternal compustion engine.
people often ask how we ended up with vhs instead of betamax, the two rival video technologies early on. the answer is simple. that is what the market chose. the markets rule whether you approve or not. always have. always will. when a gallon of gas sells for 12 bucks a gallon it will be economically feasable for someone to capitalize on profits from alternative fuels. not until. off to bed.
Doesnt make it right though. Like i said i tend to stand for what is right over what is profitable. And big business has done some good things and im sure most of their intentions at the time were good. But now with different people running them and the stockholders best interest at hand, we seem to be screwed as normal people, only able to follow like sheep in a herd. Only able to pick from certain preapproved choices.
| | 7/25/2008 2:31:08 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | |  chinaonlyabc Lancaster, CA age: 53
| jrboogie is right.. It's the market.. and the price of capital outlay and investment.. and risk. The research is very promising regarding algae and other biofuels.. such as you write jmk.. re: switchgrass.. but there is the entire distribution network that needs to be developed which will cost billions of capital investment and years to invest into. And right now.. as I hear it.. algae biofuels is still in the R&D process.. which can take a bit of time to be authorized.. then.. to get investors to invest.. that can be tricky with the competition of wind, solar, and other alternative energy sources bidding for the same monies. A matter of economics..
Now.. my opinion? Just like Brazil.. The government. will have to be involved in a subsidy program here.. such as the solar credit program in the 70's.. perhaps.. even more agressive.this time. But.. again.. who are we going to endorse.. Al Gores plan.. of electric.. or T. Boone's Pickens plan.None of these plans offer biofuels.. Frankly.. there can be room for both.. or a compromise.. for both.. And still have room for biofuels.. I happen to like Willie Nelson's biofuels. But.. his distribution operations is hampered, isn't it?
If there is a public focus on this issue.. and more jobs can be created.. as expressed by both candidates.. then there can be positive outcomes.. to help decrease the debt through increased tax revenue.. and helping our country becoming more energy independent. A win-win situation.
| | 7/25/2008 3:30:51 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | |  jmk83 Florissant, MO age: 25
| jrboogie is right.. It's the market.. and the price of capital outlay and investment.. and risk. The research is very promising regarding algae and other biofuels.. such as you write jmk.. re: switchgrass.. but there is the entire distribution network that needs to be developed which will cost billions of capital investment and years to invest into. And right now.. as I hear it.. algae biofuels is still in the R&D process.. which can take a bit of time to be authorized.. then.. to get investors to invest.. that can be tricky with the competition of wind, solar, and other alternative energy sources bidding for the same monies. A matter of economics..
Now.. my opinion? Just like Brazil.. The government. will have to be involved in a subsidy program here.. such as the solar credit program in the 70's.. perhaps.. even more agressive.this time. But.. again.. who are we going to endorse.. Al Gores plan.. of electric.. or T. Boone's Pickens plan.None of these plans offer biofuels.. Frankly.. there can be room for both.. or a compromise.. for both.. And still have room for biofuels.. I happen to like Willie Nelson's biofuels. But.. his distribution operations is hampered, isn't it?
If there is a public focus on this issue.. and more jobs can be created.. as expressed by both candidates.. then there can be positive outcomes.. to help decrease the debt through increased tax revenue.. and helping our country becoming more energy independent. A win-win situation.
I say we adopt a couple of different plans and not give any which major one a monopoly on the market.
| | 7/25/2008 7:33:39 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | |  dakwa Tulsa, OK age: 47
| One of the reasons might have been this as well, not to take economics out. Bio-fuel is not as powerful as oil based fuel, and at that time they wanted to make more efficient engines that would have expanded the development of the tranportation industry. Bio-fuel technologically would not have worked. SO in that view it would have been a major blockage that would have had to be looked at.
Remember when Ford was making his early car, they were working off from kerosine, which is not a powerful as gas or diesel fuels, but might have been as strong as kerosine.
Stanley Steamer and other steam cars were actually much better, but because of media fed fears, they lost most of their ability to sell. Remember the 1927 land speed record was set by a Stanley Steamer at 127 miles an hour.
The whole issue of fuels have come around a lot. THe old steam engines used kerosine to heat their water, in what they designed that is still used today, a "flash boiler".
THere have been a number of reasons that other technologies have not worked, but yes they do evolve around economics.
| | 7/25/2008 7:44:15 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | |  jmk83 Florissant, MO age: 25
| One of the reasons might have been this as well, not to take economics out. Bio-fuel is not as powerful as oil based fuel, and at that time they wanted to make more efficient engines that would have expanded the development of the tranportation industry. Bio-fuel technologically would not have worked. SO in that view it would have been a major blockage that would have had to be looked at.
Remember when Ford was making his early car, they were working off from kerosine, which is not a powerful as gas or diesel fuels, but might have been as strong as kerosine.
Stanley Steamer and other steam cars were actually much better, but because of media fed fears, they lost most of their ability to sell. Remember the 1927 land speed record was set by a Stanley Steamer at 127 miles an hour.
The whole issue of fuels have come around a lot. THe old steam engines used kerosine to heat their water, in what they designed that is still used today, a "flash boiler".
THere have been a number of reasons that other technologies have not worked, but yes they do evolve around economics.
I had no idea a steam egine set a land speed record, that is pretty cool actually.
| | 7/25/2008 8:01:13 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | |  theothergman Michigan, ND age: 47
| BEcause bio fuel wasn't around at the turn of the 20th century. didn't have the technology.
| | 7/25/2008 8:13:57 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | | jrbogie Red Bluff, CA age: 59
| you don't like that corporations are as powerful as they are but in reality they are what made this country great. the corporate heads at the time you speak of found oil to be the most profitable for of fuel. it was being drilled long before the automobile for the kerosene used in lighting and heating. gasoline was actually an unwanted byproduct of refining. it was a simple reach to profit from this byproduct with the invention of the eternal compustion engine.
people often ask how we ended up with vhs instead of betamax, the two rival video technologies early on. the answer is simple. that is what the market chose. the markets rule whether you approve or not. always have. always will. when a gallon of gas sells for 12 bucks a gallon it will be economically feasable for someone to capitalize on profits from alternative fuels. not until. off to bed.
Doesnt make it right though. Like i said i tend to stand for what is right over what is profitable. .
ah. could have sworn you ask why, not what is right. well, "what is right" has never built a damn thing or made one technological breakthruough has it. no business pays the the light bill and no employee will ever cash a paycheck with the words "this is right" written on it. somewhere some dollars have to come into play huh. by the way. if we're so "screwed" as you say, who provides us with jobs? and do you know who the largest group of shareholders of equities of US corporations are? would you believe it us normal people that you claim "seem to be screwed"? collectively, 401Ks, IRAs, 403Bs, 529Bs and many many mutual funds,etc. that allow everyday "normal people" like me and you, if you have the sense, to invest for our retirement and our childrens college hold the largest number of corporate stocks as a group. you really haven't given all this much thought have you?
| | 7/25/2008 8:24:21 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | |  jmk83 Florissant, MO age: 25
| you don't like that corporations are as powerful as they are but in reality they are what made this country great. the corporate heads at the time you speak of found oil to be the most profitable for of fuel. it was being drilled long before the automobile for the kerosene used in lighting and heating. gasoline was actually an unwanted byproduct of refining. it was a simple reach to profit from this byproduct with the invention of the eternal compustion engine.
people often ask how we ended up with vhs instead of betamax, the two rival video technologies early on. the answer is simple. that is what the market chose. the markets rule whether you approve or not. always have. always will. when a gallon of gas sells for 12 bucks a gallon it will be economically feasable for someone to capitalize on profits from alternative fuels. not until. off to bed.
Doesnt make it right though. Like i said i tend to stand for what is right over what is profitable. .
ah. could have sworn you ask why, not what is right. well, "what is right" has never built a damn thing or made one technological breakthruough has it. no business pays the the light bill and no employee will ever cash a paycheck with the words "this is right" written on it. somewhere some dollars have to come into play huh. by the way. if we're so "screwed" as you say, who provides us with jobs? and do you know who the largest group of shareholders of equities of US corporations are? would you believe it us normal people that you claim "seem to be screwed"? collectively, 401Ks, IRAs, 403Bs, 529Bs and many many mutual funds,etc. that allow everyday "normal people" like me and you, if you have the sense, to invest for our retirement and our childrens college hold the largest number of corporate stocks as a group. you really haven't given all this much thought have you?
I have almost always, and try as much as possible to work for, spend my money at, and help, small, independant business owners. While i do know that corporations are necassary i dont like the majority of them, or at least how they are ran today in our cutthroat global business economy. The thing that pisses me off about them and is the source of my anger towards them is there monopolizing effects, the effects they have on small businesses trying to live the american dream of working for themselves, and the out sourcing of our jobs so they can save a few bucks by paying someone in another country per week the same wage they would pay us per hour. So alot of them now adays are taking away more jobs than giving. There are some that choose to keep all there business here and give us the factory jobs that the lower middle class needs badely.
| | 7/25/2008 8:35:10 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | | jrbogie Red Bluff, CA age: 59
| you don't like that corporations are as powerful as they are but in reality they are what made this country great. the corporate heads at the time you speak of found oil to be the most profitable for of fuel. it was being drilled long before the automobile for the kerosene used in lighting and heating. gasoline was actually an unwanted byproduct of refining. it was a simple reach to profit from this byproduct with the invention of the eternal compustion engine.
people often ask how we ended up with vhs instead of betamax, the two rival video technologies early on. the answer is simple. that is what the market chose. the markets rule whether you approve or not. always have. always will. when a gallon of gas sells for 12 bucks a gallon it will be economically feasable for someone to capitalize on profits from alternative fuels. not until. off to bed.
Doesnt make it right though. Like i said i tend to stand for what is right over what is profitable. .
ah. could have sworn you ask why, not what is right. well, "what is right" has never built a damn thing or made one technological breakthruough has it. no business pays the the light bill and no employee will ever cash a paycheck with the words "this is right" written on it. somewhere some dollars have to come into play huh. by the way. if we're so "screwed" as you say, who provides us with jobs? and do you know who the largest group of shareholders of equities of US corporations are? would you believe it us normal people that you claim "seem to be screwed"? collectively, 401Ks, IRAs, 403Bs, 529Bs and many many mutual funds,etc. that allow everyday "normal people" like me and you, if you have the sense, to invest for our retirement and our childrens college hold the largest number of corporate stocks as a group. you really haven't given all this much thought have you?
I have almost always, and try as much as possible to work for, spend my money at, and help, small, independant business owners. While i do know that corporations are necassary i dont like the majority of them, or at least how they are ran today in our cutthroat global business economy. The thing that pisses me off about them and is the source of my anger towards them is there monopolizing effects, the effects they have on small businesses trying to live the american dream of working for themselves, and the out sourcing of our jobs so they can save a few bucks by paying someone in another country per week the same wage they would pay us per hour. So alot of them now adays are taking away more jobs than giving. There are some that choose to keep all there business here and give us the factory jobs that the lower middle class needs badely.
every big corporation, bar none, began as a small business. so success and productivity is what really pisses you off? hmmmmmmmm?
| | 7/25/2008 8:46:22 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | |  jmk83 Florissant, MO age: 25
| you don't like that corporations are as powerful as they are but in reality they are what made this country great. the corporate heads at the time you speak of found oil to be the most profitable for of fuel. it was being drilled long before the automobile for the kerosene used in lighting and heating. gasoline was actually an unwanted byproduct of refining. it was a simple reach to profit from this byproduct with the invention of the eternal compustion engine.
people often ask how we ended up with vhs instead of betamax, the two rival video technologies early on. the answer is simple. that is what the market chose. the markets rule whether you approve or not. always have. always will. when a gallon of gas sells for 12 bucks a gallon it will be economically feasable for someone to capitalize on profits from alternative fuels. not until. off to bed.
Doesnt make it right though. Like i said i tend to stand for what is right over what is profitable. .
ah. could have sworn you ask why, not what is right. well, "what is right" has never built a damn thing or made one technological breakthruough has it. no business pays the the light bill and no employee will ever cash a paycheck with the words "this is right" written on it. somewhere some dollars have to come into play huh. by the way. if we're so "screwed" as you say, who provides us with jobs? and do you know who the largest group of shareholders of equities of US corporations are? would you believe it us normal people that you claim "seem to be screwed"? collectively, 401Ks, IRAs, 403Bs, 529Bs and many many mutual funds,etc. that allow everyday "normal people" like me and you, if you have the sense, to invest for our retirement and our childrens college hold the largest number of corporate stocks as a group. you really haven't given all this much thought have you?
I have almost always, and try as much as possible to work for, spend my money at, and help, small, independant business owners. While i do know that corporations are necassary i dont like the majority of them, or at least how they are ran today in our cutthroat global business economy. The thing that pisses me off about them and is the source of my anger towards them is there monopolizing effects, the effects they have on small businesses trying to live the american dream of working for themselves, and the out sourcing of our jobs so they can save a few bucks by paying someone in another country per week the same wage they would pay us per hour. So alot of them now adays are taking away more jobs than giving. There are some that choose to keep all there business here and give us the factory jobs that the lower middle class needs badely.
every big corporation, bar none, began as a small business. so success and productivity is what really pisses you off? hmmmmmmmm?
Not necassarily, its when they buy up unfair amounts of the market and create a monopoly like old bill gates was caught doing, by making it were all the programs that came out could only run of his operating system(windows 95 at the time)making other competing companies not able to compete.
Another thing that pisses me off about them is they loose there sense of quality and appreciation for the consumer. From 21 to almost 25 i lived in a small mountain town in colorado. All the businesses were small family owned businesses. Everytime i went into one of them i couldnt help but notice the owners working right beside and just as hard as the employee for his living. I was also treated with respect, greeted by name, and got the impression that they greatly appreciated my business and support. When i spent my money at these small businesses i couldnt help feel like i was apart of my community and on such a scale that made me feel good. I felt like i truely making a difference in my local economy and felt like i was truely part of it. I do not get that impression when i walk into walmart or home depot.
| | 7/25/2008 9:04:37 AM | why did we choose oil over bio fuel anyway. | | jrbogie Red Bluff, CA age: 59
| you don't like that corporations are as powerful as they are but in reality they are what made this country great. the corporate heads at the time you speak of found oil to be the most profitable for of fuel. it was being drilled long before the automobile for the kerosene used in lighting and heating. gasoline was actually an unwanted byproduct of refining. it was a simple reach to profit from this byproduct with the invention of the eternal compustion engine.
people often ask how we ended up with vhs instead of betamax, the two rival video technologies early on. the answer is simple. that is what the market chose. the markets rule whether you approve or not. always have. always will. when a gallon of gas sells for 12 bucks a gallon it will be economically feasable for someone to capitalize on profits from alternative fuels. not until. off to bed.
Doesnt make it right though. Like i said i tend to stand for what is right over what is profitable. .
ah. could have sworn you ask why, not what is right. well, "what is right" has never built a damn thing or made one technological breakthruough has it. no business pays the the light bill and no employee will ever cash a paycheck with the words "this is right" written on it. somewhere some dollars have to come into play huh. by the way. if we're so "screwed" as you say, who provides us with jobs? and do you know who the largest group of shareholders of equities of US corporations are? would you believe it us normal people that you claim "seem to be screwed"? collectively, 401Ks, IRAs, 403Bs, 529Bs and many many mutual funds,etc. that allow everyday "normal people" like me and you, if you have the sense, to invest for our retirement and our childrens college hold the largest number of corporate stocks as a group. you really haven't given all this much thought have you?
I have almost always, and try as much as possible to work for, spend my money at, and help, small, independant business owners. While i do know that corporations are necassary i dont like the majority of them, or at least how they are ran today in our cutthroat global business economy. The thing that pisses me off about them and is the source of my anger towards them is there monopolizing effects, the effects they have on small businesses trying to live the american dream of working for themselves, and the out sourcing of our jobs so they can save a few bucks by paying someone in another country per week the same wage they would pay us per hour. So alot of them now adays are taking away more jobs than giving. There are some that choose to keep all there business here and give us the factory jobs that the lower middle class needs badely.
every big corporation, bar none, began as a small business. so success and productivity is what really pisses you off? hmmmmmmmm?
Not necassarily, its when they buy up unfair amounts of the market and create a monopoly like old bill gates was caught doing, by making it were all the programs that came out could only run of his operating system(windows 95 at the time)making other competing companies not able to compete.
do you have any clue as to the numbers of microsoft employees ranging from janitors, secrataries to senior vp's that are millionaires today because of their stock options that bill gates offered them? how many employees owe their jobs in not only microsoft but litterally thousands of very large corporations because of windows operating systems? how many common everyday people live in comfortable retirement because they had the sense to buy and hold MSFT since the eighties? you really haven't given this much thought either have you?
Another thing that pisses me off about them is they loose there sense of quality and appreciation for the consumer. From 21 to almost 25 i lived in a small mountain town in colorado. All the businesses were small family owned businesses. Everytime i went into one of them i couldnt help but notice the owners working right beside and just as hard as the employee for his living. I was also treated with respect, greeted by name, and got the impression that they greatly appreciated my business and support. When i spent my money at these small businesses i couldnt help feel like i was apart of my community and on such a scale that made me feel good. I felt like i truely making a difference in my local economy and felt like i was truely part of it. I do not get that impression when i walk into walmart or home depot.
ah ha, but still you walk into walmart it would seem. why is that? seems those parking lots are always quite full huh? could it be that those cars belong to consumers that you don't feel appreciate the quality of service. all walmart did was put up a building. it was you and others in town that chose not to spend your money at those small family owned businesses was it not? those hard working owners who treated you with respect and called you by name certainly did appreciate your business and that of all of their long time patrons. so why did you stop providing them with the profits they needed to feed their families. walmart had absolutely nothing to do with their failures other than to give you a sweeter deal, which it apears you and your small town populatation jumped all over?
|
|