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1/25/2015 7:01:54 AMHave churches become more a club now 
jester0011
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (30,914)
Lake Waccamaw, NC
50, joined Jun. 2014


it seems they are more like a masons,moose,lions type place to join now.what are your thoughts




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1/25/2015 7:54:06 AMHave churches become more a club now 
Yasureoktoo
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (24,136)
Seattle, WA
63, joined Dec. 2014


All through time the church was a social event for the people. It was a place of common ground, to establish a community around.

Many of the offshoots, the mens clubs, claim church roots, but really have none.

1/25/2015 10:12:05 AMHave churches become more a club now 

ludlowlowell
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (37,645)
Panama City, FL
65, joined Feb. 2008
online now!


I think a lot of Protestant churches are. I don't the Catholic Church or Eastern Orthodox Churches, with their emphasis on the Holy Eucharist, are or ever could be.

1/25/2015 10:27:11 AMHave churches become more a club now 

rufftreasure
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (19,220)
Fairmont, MN
62, joined Jun. 2014


Um , Lud, what about Knights of Columbus and all those groups , there are more, but that's just one example.
Are you kidding me? Your precious Catholic church, is no different, I am of the opinion you think your church is infallible.
Neither the pope or your church are infallible.
You have in my opinion denial about many aspects of life.

1/25/2015 11:36:16 AMHave churches become more a club now 
Yasureoktoo
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (24,136)
Seattle, WA
63, joined Dec. 2014


Shriners are a perfect of a men's club, founded on totally accidental principals, that flourished into a good organization.

1/25/2015 11:36:50 AMHave churches become more a club now 
Yasureoktoo
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (24,136)
Seattle, WA
63, joined Dec. 2014


"Perfect example",

Missed a word.

1/25/2015 11:43:15 AMHave churches become more a club now 

turkalurk82
Over 1,000 Posts (1,071)
Godfrey, IL
35, joined Sep. 2014


Quote from Yasureoktoo:
Shriners are a perfect of a men's club, founded on totally accidental principals, that flourished into a good organization.
This sounds like gibberish to me. I could use my brain and figure out what you are attempting to communicate, or I could be a Deuchebag and point out how, this statement taken exactly as it is written, sounds nonsensical. Do you understand my point? Or, am I still speaking gibberish?

1/25/2015 11:46:04 AMHave churches become more a club now 

turkalurk82
Over 1,000 Posts (1,071)
Godfrey, IL
35, joined Sep. 2014


Quote from Yasureoktoo:
"Perfect example",

Missed a word.


Too late! Also, what do you mean by founded on accidental principles? That sounds fallacious or requires more elaboration.

1/25/2015 1:40:46 PMHave churches become more a club now 
Yasureoktoo
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (24,136)
Seattle, WA
63, joined Dec. 2014


Sounds like you have serious emotional problems.

1/25/2015 1:49:43 PMHave churches become more a club now 
Yasureoktoo
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (24,136)
Seattle, WA
63, joined Dec. 2014


The Shriners were basically founded in a Tavern by a small group of friends.
They embraced the ideas from freemasonry of the middle ages, and took on the Arab, and consequently Muslim aspect, without knowing anything about Islam.
When it was formed there was only one English translation of the Qur'an, the same one Jefferson had, and not an accepted translation.
They also had no way of knowing the correct way of reading the Qur'an, and were left with any explanation from Muslims, if in fact they had any at all.
Two of the most important books of Islam were not even translated into English until the 1950s and 60s.

If they had the info available today, it is unlikely they would have taken on the format they did.

1/25/2015 2:30:50 PMHave churches become more a club now 

turkalurk82
Over 1,000 Posts (1,071)
Godfrey, IL
35, joined Sep. 2014


Serious emotional problems?
Why don't you be more specific with your insults? If you are talking about me, then I have no problems with my emotions. Unless, you consider empathy an emotional problem, which wouldn't surprise me. You are just mad, because you made a hypocrite of yourself and gave me the chance to validate my point with your sloppy use of language.

1/25/2015 2:36:24 PMHave churches become more a club now 
jester0011
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (30,914)
Lake Waccamaw, NC
50, joined Jun. 2014


they are fussing

1/25/2015 2:56:19 PMHave churches become more a club now 
Yasureoktoo
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (24,136)
Seattle, WA
63, joined Dec. 2014


Quote from turkalurk82:
Serious emotional problems?
Why don't you be more specific with your insults? If you are talking about me, then I have no problems with my emotions. Unless, you consider empathy an emotional problem, which wouldn't surprise me. You are just mad, because you made a hypocrite of yourself and gave me the chance to validate my point with your sloppy use of language.


I'm not mad at anything, I believe you are trying to validate the gibberish you spouted off before, by point out grammatical errors.

whenever the typing and grammar police show up, it is a sign the person is grasping to save face from errors they refuse to admit to.

1/25/2015 3:17:04 PMHave churches become more a club now 
jester0011
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (30,914)
Lake Waccamaw, NC
50, joined Jun. 2014


im surprised u don't have to say a secret word just to walk inside

1/25/2015 3:25:08 PMHave churches become more a club now 
ron6280a
Over 2,000 Posts (3,083)
Detroit, MI
56, joined Oct. 2013


Quote from jester0011:
im surprised u don't have to say a secret word just to walk inside


The pass phrase is......

Hey it's me, open the door

This is a secret so dont tell anyone

1/25/2015 3:26:42 PMHave churches become more a club now 

turkalurk82
Over 1,000 Posts (1,071)
Godfrey, IL
35, joined Sep. 2014


So, if you can't understand someone using english words, then it is gibberish. But, when you say things that are vague, unclear, and missing words in your sentences, then anyone who points out your flaws to exemplify your hypocrisy, is being grammar police and has serious emotional problems. Yep, sounds like something a deuchebag would say.

1/25/2015 3:55:50 PMHave churches become more a club now 

rufftreasure
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (19,220)
Fairmont, MN
62, joined Jun. 2014


He must be using spell check now, eh Jim??

1/25/2015 5:18:57 PMHave churches become more a club now 
Yasureoktoo
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (24,136)
Seattle, WA
63, joined Dec. 2014


Quote from turkalurk82:
So, if you can't understand someone using english words, then it is gibberish. But, when you say things that are vague, unclear, and missing words in your sentences, then anyone who points out your flaws to exemplify your hypocrisy, is being grammar police and has serious emotional problems. Yep, sounds like something a deuchebag would say.
Yes, you do sound like a douchebag.

This entire argument spawned from a comment you made in the religion section, which made no sense whatsoever, one where you were promptly owned by Clarence and Iyam, and still refuse to clarify your point.

Now you are trying to rectify your ignorance by pointing out typos and rural grammar.

Somehow in your mind, an addled one I might add, this proves you right.

gotta stop smoking that stuff.

1/25/2015 5:59:47 PMHave churches become more a club now 

turkalurk82
Over 1,000 Posts (1,071)
Godfrey, IL
35, joined Sep. 2014


I think you are confusing me with the op of that thread. Show me what comment did not make sense. I only defended that the op was not speaking gibberish. I could understand the point he was trying to make although I don't necessarily agree with it.

Maybe it is time for you to put the pipe down, you seem very confused.



[Edited 1/25/2015 6:01:16 PM ]

1/25/2015 6:52:03 PMHave churches become more a club now 
jester0011
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (30,914)
Lake Waccamaw, NC
50, joined Jun. 2014


yea put the pipe down

1/25/2015 7:31:28 PMHave churches become more a club now 

rufftreasure
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (19,220)
Fairmont, MN
62, joined Jun. 2014


Put the steroids down.

1/25/2015 7:33:40 PMHave churches become more a club now 
jester0011
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (30,914)
Lake Waccamaw, NC
50, joined Jun. 2014


whats up librarian lady

1/25/2015 7:53:25 PMHave churches become more a club now 

rufftreasure
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (19,220)
Fairmont, MN
62, joined Jun. 2014


Quote from jester0011:
whats up librarian lady


Just listening to oldies but goodies tunes ,and alternating icing and heating pad on my shoulder.

Or were you talking to Duchessa?



[Edited 1/25/2015 7:54:04 PM ]

1/25/2015 8:50:43 PMHave churches become more a club now 

isna_la_wica
Over 7,500 Posts!! (7,945)
Brantford, ON
63, joined Mar. 2012


1st century churches were quite often home based ones.

You would not approve of them I guess?

I my self will only attend Churches that have open communion, and welcome all.That way I stay away from those that think membership means they are special, country club style , or Nazi party style, its all the same exclusive crap to me.

Any that do not welcome all sinners, or single out groups they do not like, or insist you must be a member of their church, are lacking in the commandment Jesus gave to us. The one, that all the law hangs on.

1/26/2015 7:04:34 AMHave churches become more a club now 
jester0011
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (30,914)
Lake Waccamaw, NC
50, joined Jun. 2014


Quote from rufftreasure:
Just listening to oldies but goodies tunes ,and alternating icing and heating pad on my shoulder.

Or were you talking to Duchessa?
no u

1/26/2015 9:09:44 AMHave churches become more a club now 

rufftreasure
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (19,220)
Fairmont, MN
62, joined Jun. 2014


Quote from isna_la_wica:
1st century churches were quite often home based ones.

You would not approve of them I guess?

I my self will only attend Churches that have open communion, and welcome all.That way I stay away from those that think membership means they are special, country club style , or Nazi party style, its all the same exclusive crap to me.

Any that do not welcome all sinners, or single out groups they do not like, or insist you must be a member of their church, are lacking in the commandment Jesus gave to us. The one, that all the law hangs on.


Home based anything appeals to me more than a crowd.
And I agree, I don't want to be anywhere , where all are not included.



[Edited 1/26/2015 9:10:46 AM ]

1/26/2015 1:21:53 PMHave churches become more a club now 
jester0011
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (30,914)
Lake Waccamaw, NC
50, joined Jun. 2014


ill take the home base to

1/26/2015 7:57:20 PMHave churches become more a club now 
parie_3
West Columbia, SC
57, joined Dec. 2014


They have had to become business minded. They have to be alluring to bring in parishioners of all types and keep them coming back. They offer a product that they believe that you may want. Fellowship one with another.

1/27/2015 5:54:04 AMHave churches become more a club now 
jester0011
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (30,914)
Lake Waccamaw, NC
50, joined Jun. 2014


it seems to be that way

1/29/2015 4:29:39 PMHave churches become more a club now 
jester0011
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (30,914)
Lake Waccamaw, NC
50, joined Jun. 2014


Quote from turkalurk82:
I think you are confusing me with the op of that thread. Show me what comment did not make sense. I only defended that the op was not speaking gibberish. I could understand the point he was trying to make although I don't necessarily agree with it.

Maybe it is time for you to put the pipe down, you seem very confused.


1/29/2015 4:35:44 PMHave churches become more a club now 

ayemie
Over 4,000 Posts! (6,236)
Granite Bay, CA
47, joined Jul. 2010


There is one if those huges churches near me. It has a Starbucks in it. Last Christmas someone I know posted a picture of them at the chistmas thing the church had. I thought they were at a concert till I read what they wrote. Picture the posted showed the stage with huge screens and stone lights.

2/2/2015 6:33:01 AMHave churches become more a club now 
jester0011
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (30,914)
Lake Waccamaw, NC
50, joined Jun. 2014


looks like a club to me

2/2/2015 7:38:26 AMHave churches become more a club now 

paulrxp
Miami, FL
50, joined Aug. 2014


Quote from rufftreasure:
Um , Lud, what about Knights of Columbus and all those groups , there are more, but that's just one example.
Are you kidding me? Your precious Catholic church, is no different, I am of the opinion you think your church is infallible.
Neither the pope or your church are infallible.
You have in my opinion denial about many aspects of life.



You have no understanding of what infallible means, or even how and when it's been applied to Church doctrines, it does not imply impeccability, perfection, or that a Pope or Bishop is sinless. If the standard to Non-Catholic christians are applied, then every pastor, bishop, or preacher in protestantism is also a pope. Protestant leaders of whatever denomination teach, pastor and define their individual teachings to their congregations. Perhaps that's why they arrive and varying conflicting understanding of doctrines. The Rapture is a perfect example. Pretrib, post-trib, mid-trib. These conflicts and competing beliefs is exactly what infallibility tries to prevent, multiple truth and opinion. Instead of one truth, that do not confuse the faithful.

The thread was about the churches being social groups, it was probably referring to the liturgical service drawing members merely to socialize instead of worship. The Knights of Columbus is a fraternal, charitable organization that's part of the Church, but you can't use that association to say the Church is a social club, because it has organizations within it that resemble a club. KOC members are obligated to attend Mass, what they do as far as socializing , even for charity beyond that is an entirely different matter. Now the freemasons, that's a different story, don't confuse the two, they're polar opposites lol

2/2/2015 9:12:52 AMHave churches become more a club now 

rufftreasure
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (19,220)
Fairmont, MN
62, joined Jun. 2014


Okay,I'll need reliable source, as Lud rarely provides any.
I would be interested to see what you have for source material.
Then I might accept and understand your infallible thing. Also the understanding of the differences of Catholic organizations.
Thank you.

2/2/2015 10:27:16 AMHave churches become more a club now 

paulrxp
Miami, FL
50, joined Aug. 2014


Quote from rufftreasure:
Okay,I'll need reliable source, as Lud rarely provides any.
I would be interested to see what you have for source material.
Then I might accept and understand your infallible thing. Also the understanding of the differences of Catholic organizations.
Thank you.


Ruff, nothing personal in the tone of my reply. On occasion I'll go with my evangelical pals to their service. It's out of love for their love of Christ. Many of the folks in his evangelical church live and breath the gospel better than many Catholics I know. Catholics who are the biggest hypocrites, and who'll get a tongue lashing from me simply because they should know better about what the faith teaches and what's expect of them. With my protestant buddies and even non-believers, I can't hold them to that, because naturally they haven't learned about what we profess to believe. One thing I won't do is be indifferent.Not giving a damn about someones soul simply because I fear they'll be offended isn't what the gospels were about, it's what our culture is about

2/2/2015 10:39:14 AMHave churches become more a club now 

rufftreasure
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (19,220)
Fairmont, MN
62, joined Jun. 2014


I took no offense, and hope you didn't either.
I would just like to see reliable source of these doctrines and enjoy having reasonable interchange of thoughts as well as opinion. The doctrine and dogma that causes your belief, your faith. We are humans who need to learn and understand each other, a part of love for one another.

2/2/2015 11:10:19 AMHave churches become more a club now 

paulrxp
Miami, FL
50, joined Aug. 2014


Quote from rufftreasure:
I took no offense, and hope you didn't either.
I would just like to see reliable source of these doctrines and enjoy having reasonable interchange of thoughts as well as opinion. The doctrine and dogma that causes your belief, your faith. We are humans who need to learn and understand each other, a part of love for one another.


Ok glad to hear that. And no I didn't take offense. I tell my Catholic buddies if theyre too thin skinned for criticism,Catholicism probably won't be your cup of tea. I enjoy learning about my other Christians friends, evangelical, 7th Day Adventists, Baptists. And I always get a good laugh from my atheist and raging gnostic know it all buddies It would be boring if I just preached to the choir lol

It really saddens me though to see how Christianity has been divided. Unfortunately, the secular worlds belief that ideology matters more than spirituality has been adopted by Christians. So I suppose we Christians have to accept the blame. The best way to evangelize these heathens lol is for us to live the gospels Truths. Let them answer their own questions about why living life without faith is better. Anyways theirs always football to look forward to on Sundays, i mean after Sept at least. And um you know, the rest of the year they could like hang out with the cat and annoy Christians on internet forums, life is worth living lol

2/2/2015 12:21:33 PMHave churches become more a club now 

rufftreasure
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (19,220)
Fairmont, MN
62, joined Jun. 2014


Yes, I believe actions speak louder than words, and a best example is an observable one.
I'm into humor . But as any one here can tell you I love to spar and can give as good as I get.
Lud, and I share a common ground, we both love the Beach Boys.
I'm not into spectator sports that much but I run a musica thread in General Discussion at the format is a make believe bar, with musica and dancing , food and beverages ,and of course big screen T.V. for watching the games with partying.
I wouldn't be much of a host without the play by plays and reporting the scores, now would I??



[Edited 2/2/2015 12:22:21 PM ]

2/2/2015 2:24:24 PMHave churches become more a club now 
Yasureoktoo
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (24,136)
Seattle, WA
63, joined Dec. 2014


My Karma

Ran over, your Dogma.

2/2/2015 2:30:14 PMHave churches become more a club now 

paulrxp
Miami, FL
50, joined Aug. 2014


Quote from Yasureoktoo:
My Karma

Ran over, your Dogma.


Only cuz you were a reincarnated Cat driving the car. Good luck when you step out of that car

2/2/2015 2:31:46 PMHave churches become more a club now 

rufftreasure
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (19,220)
Fairmont, MN
62, joined Jun. 2014


I'm busy mourning, someone dropped a house on my sister the other day.

2/2/2015 4:01:12 PMHave churches become more a club now 

duchessa
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (40,700)
Yonkers, NY
64, joined Aug. 2008


Quote from jester0011:
it seems they are more like a masons,moose,lions type place to join now.what are your thoughts


Dear, I was the Vice-President of one of the Lyons Clubs in Yonkers. I would appreciate, deeply, if you don't insult the Lyons C. by comparing the church with them...The Lyons Club, which is the world largest service organization, dedicates all efforts to help people with eyesight problems....unlike the churches which are institutions that do nothing for mankind... nothing more than flatten people's brains and take away the fools' money.

For your info, guy, the churches don't spend any money to buy the food given to the poor...or the clothing. No, the first one is given to the churches -all- by the municipal food pantries, local grocers and markets...and the item of clothing are donated by the neighbors.

2/2/2015 6:45:38 PMHave churches become more a club now 

smthgabouther
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,095)
Baltimore, MD
36, joined Dec. 2012


To be near a church is to be far from God.

-Proverb

2/2/2015 11:02:27 PMHave churches become more a club now 

paulrxp
Miami, FL
50, joined Aug. 2014


Quote from duchessa:
Dear, I was the Vice-President of one of the Lyons Clubs in Yonkers. I would appreciate, deeply, if you don't insult the Lyons C. by comparing the church with them...The Lyons Club, which is the world largest service organization, dedicates all efforts to help people with eyesight problems....unlike the churches which are institutions that do nothing for mankind... nothing more than flatten people's brains and take away the fools' money.

For your info, guy, the churches don't spend any money to buy the food given to the poor...or the clothing. No, the first one is given to the churches -all- by the municipal food pantries, local grocers and markets...and the item of clothing are donated by the neighbors.


No maam, you're sadly misinformed. I see it Saturday mornings. The hungry getting fed. No strings, nothing required of them, no membership or obligations to attend church. That's the way it should be. Many local churches do get free food from grocers and business where surplus food is used at food banks or whatever church programs are in place to feed the poor. My church gets food the same way partially, the other part are volunteers who cook the food in their homes, on their time, with money donated by the faithful. Don't insult the good people who donate their money, silently, without anyone ever needing to know the good that money does. These are good people who merely do what their faith calls them to do.

Besides, what's the ultimate goal for feeding and providing for the poor? To help those most in need, or to glorify yourself to society about how charitable and righteous you are? It's not how you get something. It's how you give it away without expecting anything in return. If some churches get free food and feed the hungry , great . Why should it matter how they get the food? You'd do the Lyons club a better service not comparing yourselves with anyone. Focus on the mission, and mankind will benefit more.

2/2/2015 11:25:58 PMHave churches become more a club now 
luxorus
Over 4,000 Posts! (4,034)
Peoria, IL
39, joined Apr. 2014


yes

2/9/2015 5:41:46 AMHave churches become more a club now 
jester0011
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (30,914)
Lake Waccamaw, NC
50, joined Jun. 2014


makes u wonder if u don't have to know a secret hand shake just to walk in